Dod_Hill_Classic Options

[Septien]

Here are the waypoints sprint/compatible (Rcbot 0.76) for probably my all time favorite Dod and DodS map: dod_hill_classic.









You can download the map here: http://dods.gamebanana.com/maps/14733

I have included the waypoints here (0.76 compatible):  dod_hill_classic.zip ( 14.46k ) Number of downloads: 744


A much improved gameplay, Axis will try to defend their base and each of their flags in a more balanced way. Thanks to MadMax2, Allies are able to capture the last waypoint which was impossible since bots can't capture points that are separated from their respective flag. Now with breakable waypoints this map rocks! Only Allies will try to shoot down the Axis' fortress wall.

Lastly, I would recommend having 6 Allies vs 4 Axis. That way it will be way more competitive.
Or play 4 vs 4 but team up with the Allies.

I hope you guys enjoy it, I spent quite some time trying to enhance the gameplay etc.

Pepois

[madmax2]

If I understood sniper and machine gun waypoints should have the same area as the capture point/flag they are attacking.

Sure, i'll check it out sometime later today. Yes, as a general rule, thats correct, sniper/mg/defend/capture wpts should have the same area as the nearby flag area. As cheeseh said, the flag area is set by the mapper, and rcbot reads this when placing a flag wpt. So, other special wpts in the area should be the same area number.

Now I have been experimenting with this a bit on dod_flash, breaking the rule, by placing different area tags on a few of those in between areas. Trying to get one or 2 bots to move further forward into the map when they get backed up. I have something in the works for flash, a demonstration wpt you might say, but haven't finished it yet... I've had mixed results with it, getting it balanced, but plan to finish & post it...

Now as far as I know, areas on unreachable wpts are not necessary & don't do anything...? Unreachables are simply a marker to help bots locate danger locations (& stimulate grenade throwing), usually from a distance, as i understand them... So, areas on them shouldn't be needed... They are also suppose to block bots from trying to walk to them, but that didn't happen on that one wall flag in this map!!

max

[Septien]

Sure, i'll check it out sometime later today. Yes, as a general rule, thats correct, sniper/mg/defend/capture wpts should have the same area as the nearby flag area. As cheeseh said, the flag area is set by the mapper, and rcbot reads this when placing a flag wpt. So, other special wpts in the area should be the same area number.

Now I have been experimenting with this a bit on dod_flash, breaking the rule, by placing different area tags on a few of those in between areas. Trying to get one or 2 bots to move further forward into the map when they get backed up. I have something in the works for flash, a demonstration wpt you might say, but haven't finished it yet... I've had mixed results with it, getting it balanced, but plan to finish & post it...

Now as far as I know, areas on unreachable wpts are not necessary & don't do anything...? Unreachables are simply a marker to help bots locate danger locations (& stimulate grenade throwing), usually from a distance, as i understand them... So, areas on them shouldn't be needed... They are also suppose to block bots from trying to walk to them, but that didn't happen on that one wall flag in this map!!

max

Thank you for the insight Max! Btw, you sure did a hell of a job with dod_flash! I also love that map.

Pepois

[madmax2]

Thank you for the insight Max! Btw, you sure did a hell of a job with dod_flash! I also love that map.

Pepois

Pepois

Thanks for the compliment. I worked very hard on modifying the flash rcw... There still may be another update at some point, but I think the one I posted in the flash thread is fairly good...?

Hey Max,

Sounds great! I would love to give your Sora a try!

Btw I was trying out the bots in dod_hill_classic last nite too and made some final modifications... I added prone waypoints to all flags so now bot will always capture them once they are inside the bunkers. I also added unreachable waypoints with their corresponding area... I think now I got the hang of it. I have updated all links including the one I did for the sniper map.

If I understood sniper and machine gun waypoints should have the same area as the capture point/flag they are attacking. And unreachable waypoints should have the corresponding area where they are located. I would love if you could take a look at the sniper/machine gun wpts and unreachable wpts and let me know if they are ok.

Pepois

First I should say, everything below the next paragragh is just opinion, and how I would approach waypointing this, what you have done so far works very well, and my suggestions might not work well? It's just ideas for discussion, if you are still working on this? It's such a huge map for the bots to defend, there are probably many ways to wpt it....

I took a look at hill last night with the .73beta. The area tags looked ok to me. I do have a couple more ideas for you if you want to work on this more? I should check it out with the latest .74 release though...

One thing I can suggest now, is at the axis spawn area, make those ladders one-way, up only. There is no reason I can see for axis bots to go back down the ladders there, once they are up them. And at the the stairs there too, put a one way path at the bottom of the stairs, this will allow bots to take cover at the stairs, but will prevent them from back tracking to the ladders. I've seen a number of axis bots return to these ladders & go back down them, this will prevent that....

Opinion:
Another thing, as an ally, I didn't have too much trouble working my way around the back side of the fortress using the stairs or huge wall on the east side, I think it was area1 bunker side. Also, the allies seem to cap the first 3 bunkers fairly easily now. Any axis snipers/mg's in there probably get shot in the back when an allied bot/player goes in there. So, what I suggest first, is at the entrance to each bunker, remove the defend tags you have there, inside the bunkers, just make those wpts normal/area0 wpts. Then outside area1 bunker put a couple area1 defend wpts maybe one on the big wall there, and one on the path leading to the back side of the fortress. Keep both near and in sight of the stairs and bunker entrance there.. The defend wpts are goto/short camping wpts for the bots, this will help them patrol and protect the front bunkers better, I think... i think there is a blowable wall in this map somplace, but haven't really looked for it. Players might try to use that if its on the back side of the fortress. But I think you want to concentrate the defenses on the front side, like it is now, I think they just need to cover the outside of the bunkers a little better. West side bunker (area2), may not need much, due to the high traffic there, maybe one defend on the path outside the west wall facing area2 & main fortress entrance. The forward, area0 bunker is a bit tricky, maybe just put a couple area0 defend wpts on the short wall in front of the fortress, one on each side of the nonflagged bunker, facing area0 bunker. this, and the area1 defend wpts will help keep a constant flow of bots to that east front corner of the map, and they will camp a short while too.

Another reason I suggest this, is because of the thick wall on the front of the fortress, the snipers/mg's there can't see the enemies right below them, and the allies can just run right by them. Also, inside the bunkers, you might want to seperate the mg & sniper wpts into sniper only & mg only, one at each window. Or you could make the forward facing ones combo sniper/mg, like they are now, and make the side ones mg only or defend only. I'm thinking in terms of sniper=long range, mg=medium range, and defend=short range. So put each class only where they are most useful, and spread them out on the front half of the fortress, it's such a huge area for them to cover.

With .73beta, bots seem to have some visibilty issues with the thick wall in front and at the AAA sniper position, which can't be placed any better than you have it now. The sniper there isn't seeing allies coming up the path too well, it may be the angle, not sure? For that I should test this with .74 first, to see if it's the same or not? But if it's the same, first try removing the unreachable right in front of the sniper, and see what that does? If that doesn't help, connect a path from the sniper wpt down to the unreachable on the concrete block in the path there, maybe repeat this for each concrete block there. According to what everyone has been saying, this should not be needed for snipers, so it may not help? Maybe changing the yaw/angle would help? I don't know if it's fixable, I just see the allies run up the path sometimes and shoot this sniper in the back.

Anyways, just idea's, if you are still playing around with this. I don't know how well they will work, just things I might try...

Best Regards,
max

P.S. I posted a sora_b3 rcw, you can try out, if you want too...?